Protestantism

» Migisi - EXACTLY!!

In response to EXACTLY!! posted by pink101:
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How would you have liked to have been born in to an environment where you were as free as a man to pursue your own desires?
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I AM as free as a man to pursue my own desires -- thanks to the courageous sisters (and brothers) who came before me - who fought vigorously for social and economic equality. And my own personal battle against injustice which benefits my daughter and grand daughters. My girls can be and do ANYTHING they want to. They just have to want it bad enough. That's true for men ~and~ women.
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It's all about attitude, Pink. If one ~believes~ that he's oppressed, then he surely is - and that negative attitude can paralyse personal progress. Whining about being downtrodden and treated unfairly won't bring about change. POSITIVE ACTION does. That's where most fall down. They'd rather complain than get off their butts and DEMAND their rights. It can be scary, but no pain, no gain. As I see it, anyway.

-- posted by Migisi

» pink101 - Extremely Fortunate!

In response to EXACTLY!! posted by Migisi:
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"I AM as free as a man to pursue my own desires ..."
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So YOU say. And, I hear you loud and clear. But, like you also say, "It's all about attitude...". It sure is and most women experience the Bifurcation within their own soul as though it were their conscience. Maybe YOU have overcome the demons and shown your daughters the light of feminist philosophy; but, billions of women across the world live in darkness.
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Life is more than what you and I experience on a personal basis.
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We are extremely fortunate to live in America where truth cannot be silenced except by the ignorance of those who choose to turn their heads away like so many that you and I know!
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-- posted by pink101

» Brian Tubbs - Kudos to Migisi

In response to EXACTLY!! posted by Migisi:

It's all about attitude, Pink. If one ~believes~ that he's oppressed, then he surely is - and that negative attitude can paralyse personal progress. Whining about being downtrodden and treated unfairly won't bring about change. POSITIVE ACTION does. That's where most fall down. They'd rather complain than get off their butts and DEMAND their rights. It can be scary, but no pain, no gain. As I see it, anyway.

I don't think I've agreed with you THIS much in a long time, Migisi. Very well said.

» pink101 - Protestant Christianity

In response to Kudos to Migisi posted by BrianTubbs:
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I think the most obvious point to be made here is that Brian is operating within the framework of the discipline of his expertise--Protestant Christianity.
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And, why not? It makes sense that he would stay within the area that is known as "in the true". Each discipline has that aspect of its own scholarship. And, as this site is dedicated to Protestantism, it is normal to expect the "true" to be relative to it as a discipline.
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And, that is part of what feminism is about, isn't it?
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Feminism comes out of the discipline of sociology and it has migrated across disciplines to include others including the arts and history. So, in a sense, it can be seen as a cross disciplinary form of "true" that was confined to specific disciplines in the past.
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Confused?
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Feminists take their form of "true" across the board to whatever discipline happens to be on the table--and Protestant Christianity is no exception.
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-- posted by pink101

» Brian Tubbs - Protestant Christianity

In response to Protestant Christianity posted by pink101:

I would say that I'm most comfortable discussing issues that pertain to either Protestant Christianity or American history. Those are my areas of expertise. But that's not a statement of judgmentalism. It's just a statement of humility. When I step out of those areas, I need to listen more.

» Migisi - Extremely Fortunate!

In response to Extremely Fortunate! posted by pink101:

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So YOU say.
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Yep, I can only speak for myself. But maybe I reflect the positive attitudes of today's female police officers, astronauts, airline pilots, newspaper editors, doctors, lawyers, business owners, carpenters, electricians, soldiers, college professors, and yes, female ministers and pastors, etc. The women who ~believed~ they could be and do whatever they wanted and worked towards that goal. My goodness, we're even on the golf course nowadays. Gasp! (wink)
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... Maybe YOU have overcome the demons and shown your daughters the light of feminist philosophy; but, billions of women across the world live in darkness.
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There's hope, dear Pink. There are courageous feminist sisters and brothers actively working in every country in the world to bring about social and economic change for ALL women everywhere. In some countries, it can cost them their very lives! It takes time, unfortunately, to change social structure - AND to change women's own limiting perceptions of themselves. By example, we lead.
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Life is more than what you and I experience on a personal basis.
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That's for sure. I learn that from everyone I meet.
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We are extremely fortunate to live in America where truth cannot be silenced except by the ignorance of those who choose to turn their heads away like so many that you and I know!
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Fortunate indeed!! But ya know, even the ignorant will have no choice but to accept change, cuz change is the only thing constant in life. Social and economic progress benefits everybody - including those who kick and scream against it.

-- posted by Migisi

» Migisi - Kudos to Migisi

In response to Kudos to Migisi posted by BrianTubbs:
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I don't think I've agreed with you THIS much in a long time, Migisi. Very well said.
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See... you're a feminist at heart!

-- posted by Migisi

» pink101 - "Words" and "Things"

In response to Extremely Fortunate! posted by Migisi:
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The dictionary defines feminism as a movement that advocates equal rights for women.
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But, according to what I have learned about feminism from its leading experts, that is not the case. Feminism does NOT reach out for equal rights so much as it claims society is based on wrong headed thinking and that personal experience shows us that the way "things" are is highly questionable if not absolutely wrong..
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Feminism goes on to explain that the very "words" we use to transmit messages to each other are loaded in such a way so that they favor the idea that truth is located in the past. That is probably why Brian made his statements about language earlier in this thread.
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Other theories and philosophies should be included in any serious look at the subject of feminism--post structuralism and post modernism.
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It might be pertinent to say that feminism advocates an entire revamping of how we even look at reality itself.
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More than that, it could be said that feminism has unlocked to doors to rethinking the human experience including such "things" as our institutions; religion, education, government, economy, and the family itself. And, if this is true, then we might have a clue as to the big problems we are faced with in society today. So, feminism is an appropriate subject to discuss in relationship to religion; because, it questions the roots of religious thought.
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So, feminism can be seen as being about "words" and "things" in a certain way.
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-- posted by pink101

» pink101 - Managerial

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Another aspect of feminism has to do with the way we all are managed by the "words" and "things" that were already in place when we were born.
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Men ~ long since dead ~ created the major religions by which our personal experience is defined. We can only move into the roles that have already been laid out and defined by the language we speak.
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-- posted by pink101

» Migisi - Managerial

In response to Managerial posted by pink101:

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Men ~ long since dead ~ created the major religions by which our personal experience is defined. We can only move into the roles that have already been laid out and defined by the language we speak.
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Those limitations are true for the orthodox.

It's unlikely you'd find a feminist actively involved in a patriarchal orthodox religion. However, I believe that religion evolves as society evolves, hence, the emergence of a liberal spirituality which is so often denounced by the orthodox. Just my view, of course.

-- posted by Migisi