Protestantism

» pink101 - Tower of Babel

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Is that Babel like babble?
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When do you move on?
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-- posted by pink101

» redback - understanding

In response to understanding posted by paper_turtle:

You seem at an interesting place in what bothers you or not about the Bible. And you give interesting options to explore. Ispiration can come from within a story or within a piece of art. And I can understand those who use the Bible for that specific purpose. But as they say, the Devil is in the detail.

And he's one ornery critter to avoid at all costs.

-- posted by redback

» redback - Migisi POV

In response to Migisi POV posted by Migisi:

"Clearly, metaphor didn't stop at the Flood"

I did understand that. I was pondering just how far the metaphor extends within the one story. So, Biblical accounts come across as a parable for us to learn the moral to the story where the names and events were changed to protect the innocent. I wasn't hung up on terms like 'mataphor' 'literal' etc but I don't use 'parable' in daily dialogue...and 'truth' seesm over-rated.

-- posted by redback

» paper_turtle - devil's in the details?

In response to devil's in the details? posted by Migisi:

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Migisi wrote:
Seems Paul didn't see any point in discussing details. He directed his followers to pay no attention to Jewish myths (Titus 1:14); not to devote themselves to myths and endless genealogies (1Tim1:4); and have nothing to do with godless myths and old wives' tales (1Tim4:7). By these verses and his use of 'myths' (in the NIV, "fables" in KJV), Paul clearly acknowledged that Jewish myths/fables existed and he warned them about believing them.
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Perhaps Paul's instruction is reason why most Christians don't examine the details in the OT Jewish legends (myths/fables) and genealogies?
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Yes, but I think its important to look at why Paul gave those instructions. Most often, such injunctions are given in the context of avoiding what is divisive and tends to lead people into being judgmental. Quibbling over the details is divisive, and leads no where. Paul continually stresses what will build community (in the sense of a cohesive whole which will work for the benefit of all its members, and perhaps the world at large).
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Intellectual arguments about how many angels can dance on the head of a pin do not transform lives, or soften hardened hearts. They do not heal broken minds, bodies, or spirits.
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From a purely personal POV: I did not attend church regularly until I was in my teens, but the churches I visited as a child were main-line Protestant churches in Vermont. The location is important. New Englanders are restrained, and tacitern. The congregation does not engage in a lot of outward demonstrations of emotion during a church service.
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And the sermons are directed towards applying the New Testament lectionary passage of the week to one's daily life. A New England Protestant minister does not thunder from the pulpit. He did not point an accusatory finger at the congregation and tell them they are all despicable worms. In other words, I grew up thinking that the entire world worshipped as the people I knew did--it was THE norm. This is still the style of worship in which I feel at home. I just can't quite relate to any other style.
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That unconscious assumption about what the norm is obviously still influences my thinking. Still, it seems consistent with what Paul was talking about--a weekly love-feast which gives people the "food" they need to walk the walk the rest of the week. To my mind, quibbling over details would be the same as feeding my spirit junk food.
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peace and love,
Paper Turtle

-- posted by paper_turtle

» paper_turtle - Quote re redemption

In response to devil's in the details? posted by paper_turtle:

This feels highly relevant to what we've been discussing:

This was the fullness of time, when Christ Jesus did come, that the Messiah should come. It was so to the Jews, and it was so to the Gentiles too... Christ hath excommunicated no nation, no shire, no house, no man; He gives none of His ministers leave to say to any man, thou art not redeemed; He gives no wounded or afflicted conscience leave to say to itself, I am not redeemed.
- John Donne

peace and love,
Paper Turtle

-- posted by paper_turtle

» Migisi - Tower of Babel

In response to Tower of Babel posted by pink101:

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When do you move on?
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I made a small effort to move on in my post 89. But I guess we're not done discussing interpretations. I'm okay with that. The rest of Chapter 11 is kinda boring anyway (to me). Just more genealogy.
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Feel free to carry on. I'm off today to party with old friends. It's a tradition on the 1st of a new year, and I wouldn't miss it for anything... even if I need sled dogs to get there.
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Have a good one, ya'll.

-- posted by Migisi

» pink101 - Chapter 11

In response to Tower of Babel posted by Migisi:

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Here's how chapter 11 ends:
"27 This is the account of Terah.
Terah became the father of Abram, Nahor and Haran. And Haran became the father of Lot. 28 While his father Terah was still alive, Haran died in Ur of the Chaldeans, in the land of his birth. 29 Abram and Nahor both married. The name of Abram's wife was Sarai, and the name of Nahor's wife was Milcah; she was the daughter of Haran, the father of both Milcah and Iscah. 30 Now Sarai was barren; she had no children.

31 Terah took his son Abram, his grandson Lot son of Haran, and his daughter-in-law Sarai, the wife of his son Abram, and together they set out from Ur of the Chaldeans to go to Canaan. But when they came to Haran, they settled there.

32 Terah lived 205 years, and he died in Haran."
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This makes chapter 11 one of the most important kick offs in the entire Bible with the birth of Abram and his marriate to Sarah.

-- posted by pink101

» redback - wet behind the ears

In response to Tower of Babel posted by Migisi:

"...I made a small effort to move on in my post 89..."

Apologies for my treading water. What Genesis means from a book study POV and what if anything, it could mean to my personal spiritual development was always going to be 2 separate issues. I'm underwhelmed from a spiritual POV. I felt my posts were like water going down a drain...the water a metaphor for my thoughts.

But then, my body and brain haven't been in Full HD 1080 sync these last few days.

A hot summer's day when a sled ride in snow sounds mighty tempting.

-- posted by redback

» Migisi - wet behind the ears

In response to wet behind the ears posted by redback:

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Apologies for my treading water.
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No apology needed. I've been enjoying the exchanges too.
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I'm underwhelmed from a spiritual POV.
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So far, Genesis hasn't impressed me in that way either. But I wonder if this 'book of beginnings' was originally intended to inspire, or merely record Hebrew genealogy and cultural legends.
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A hot summer's day when a sled ride in snow sounds mighty tempting.
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You can have the sled. I'll take the warm sun. I just finished shoveling 2 foot high (.61 meters) snow drifts off my driveway and sidewalks. It's 4 degrees (15 C) outside. I sure wish I'd bought that snow blower.

-- posted by Migisi

» Migisi - Chapter 11

In response to Chapter 11 posted by pink101:
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Forgot to write a reply before I pressed 'update'. Sheesh. Cold must've froze my brain.
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Ignore this.

-- posted by Migisi