Protestantism

» pink101 - Davis & Moore -- ERATA

In response to Davis & Moore posted by pink101:

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Correction. That was volume 10, in the event anyone wants to look it up at their local library. And it can be found on pages 242--249.
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-- posted by pink101

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» pink101 - Davis & Moore -- Continued

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"The reason why religion is necessary is apparently to be found in the fact that human society achieves its unity primarily through the possession by its members of certain ultimate values and ends [held] in common. Although these values and ends are subjective, they influence behavior, and their integration enables the society to operate as a system."
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"Derived neither from inherited nor from external nature, they have evolved as a part of culture by communication and moral pressure. They must, however, appear to the members of the society to have some reality, and it is the role of religious belief and ritual to supply and reinforce the appearance of reality."

-- posted by pink101

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» Migisi - Davis & Moore -- Continued

In response to Davis & Moore -- Continued posted by pink101:

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I think the keys words here are 'appear... to have some reality', and 'appearance of reality'. The question in my mind is ~how~ one can make a fantasy 'appear' real.
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Proof by Assertion http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proof_by_as...

-- posted by Migisi

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» pink101 - My Three Quotes

In response to Davis & Moore -- Continued posted by Migisi:
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My three quotes are one paragraph:
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"The reason why religion is necessary is apparently to be found in the fact that human society achieves its unity primarily through the possession by its members of certain ultimate values and ends [held] in common. Although these values and ends are subjective, they influence behavior, and their integration enables the society to operate as a system.
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"Derived neither from inherited nor from external nature, they have evolved as a part of culture by communication and moral pressure. They must, however, appear to the members of the society to have some reality, and it is the role of religious belief and ritual to supply and reinforce the appearance of reality.
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"Through belief and ritual the common ends and values are connected with an imaginary world symbolized by concrete sacred objects, which world in turn is related in a meaningful way to the facts and trials of the individual's life. Through the worship of the sacred objects and the beings they symbolize, and the acceptance of supernatural prescriptions that are at the same time codes of behavior, a powerful control over human conduct is exercised, guiding it along lines sustaining the institutional structure and conforming to the ultimate ends and values." (My bold emphasis)
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It will be interesting to find out how this movie, The Golden Compass, deals with this opening paragraph to the Davis & Moore essay.

-- posted by pink101

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» pink101 - Next Paragraph

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"If this conception of the role of religion is true, one can understand why in every known society the religious activities tend to be under the charge of particular persons, who tend thereby to enjoy greater rewards that the ordinary societal members. Certain of the rewards and special privileges may attach to only the highest religious functionaries, but others usually apply, if such exists, to the entire sacerdotal class."
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So, far, these two scholars seem to be right on.
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Think Ayatollah and Mullah.
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-- posted by pink101

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» pink101 - And ....

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"Moreover, there is a peculiar relation between the duties of the religious official and the special privileges he enjoys. If the supernatural world governs the destinies of men more ultimately than does the real world, its earthly representative, the person through whom one may communicate with the supernatural must be a powerful individual. He is a keeper of sacred tradition, a skilled performer of the ritual, and an interpreter of lore and myth. He is in such close contact with the gods that he is viewed as possessing some of their characteristics. He is, in short, a bit sacred, and hence free from some of the more vulgar necessities and controls."

-- posted by pink101

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» pink101 - Problem With Religion In Politics

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The Problem With Religion In Politics
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It is almost a forgone conclusion in American politics that religion plays one of--if not the most--important roles in our presidential elections.
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So, what's wrong with that? It looks like a good idea when one takes honesty and morality into consideration. We ALL know that religious persons are more trustworthy than others where truthfulness and morality are concerned. Who ever heard of a highly religious person telling a lie or of one being involved in anything unwholesome? Goodness gracious!! Sakes alive!!
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So, when it comes to honesty and morality, it sure looks like religion getting into our politics is a good thing. Yet, we know that there is an injunction against a combination of church and state. Why?
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One of the things about government is that it recognizes law and authority in its operations. And another is that it deals with a sense of our present world--the day to day realities. Whereas, Religion is concerned about a different world--a reality beyond government while at the same time it has its own laws and authority. This is the area of concern that surfaces when we consider a mix of politics and religion which is the side door through which the combination of church and state enters our American society.
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Beware of religion in politics

-- posted by pink101

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» Migisi - And ....

In response to And .... posted by pink101:
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"...He is, in short, a bit sacred, and hence free from some of the more vulgar necessities and controls."
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As we can see in the Oral Roberts thread. These sacred religious officials see themselves as above and outside of the 'vulgar' secular laws/controls - and even their own religion's prohibitions. They are free to do as they please by divine entitlement. They've convinced most of their followers (not all) that they deserve special consideration and privileges. Indeed, "He is in such close contact with the gods that he is viewed as possessing some of their characteristics."
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If such a religious official assumed a leadership role in national government, what makes anyone believe that he would not consider himself divinely entitled to ignore/circumvent 'vulgar' secular laws? After all, government rulers are ordained by God (Rom 13), and no one has the right to question their authority (2 Peter 2:10).

-- posted by Migisi

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» pink101 - And, Further

In response to And .... posted by Migisi:

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And, further,
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"It is no accident, therefore, that religious functionaries have been associated with the highest positions of power, as in theocratic regimes. Indeed, looking at it from this point of view, one may wonder why it is that they do not get entire control over their societies. The factors that prevent this are worthy of note."
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-- posted by pink101

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» pink101 - In The First Place

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"In the first place, the amount of technical competence necessary for the performance of religious duties is small. Scientific or artistic capacity is not required. Anyone can set himself up as enjoying an intimate relation with deities, and nobody can successfully dispute him. Therefore, the factor or scarcity of personnel does not operate in the technical sense."
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-- posted by pink101

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