Protestantism

» pink101 - Class Action

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The term, Class Action, agrees with the definition I gave above.
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Within a class, individuals compete with each other to gain access to any service or product they might desire. The under classes compete with each other for jobs and other things we consider necessary for living life at the minimum levels. The upper classes compete with each other for things that are superfluous as far as maintaining life is concerned. Two very different levels of existence--a true factor of division.
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So, in the sense of being divided, the thing that divides us is the economic class ti which we belong.
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So, how does class action enter into the picture?
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Consider the working class Americans who worked in the automotive industry and how they struggled to get higher wages and benefits. They struggled within the economic system to improve their life styles and they did a fantastic job of it. But, take into consideration the corporate interests of the investors--they were on the other side of the bargaining table and, when the workers gained, the investors lost. One might want to argue that point; but, it is easy to show the situation of the investor class, that is the corporate directors.
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In their struggle for more wealth and power, they made it their business to get favorable government decisions to open something up we have come to call Free Trade. Now, the bargaining tables for the workers in the automotive industry has changed. No longer are they alone in their competition for the jobs. The workers in China and other foreign countries have entered into the fray and American jobs are lost. This is the result of Class Action on the part of the investor classes.
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It may seem a little complicated; but, it is easy enough to see how religion is used in this struggle between the wealthy classes and the working and other under classes. But, to see it, one has to open one's eyes and allow information in that is otherwise shut out.
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-- posted by pink101

» pink101 - Score One

In response to Class Action posted by pink101:

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Score one for the Wealthy Investor Class.
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Gee, they're just being good stewards...
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-- posted by pink101

» pink101 - Post Modernism

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For what it's worth.
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This thread asks the simple question, What divides us?.
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Good question.
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Maybe the answer lies in the difficulty that some of us have with the idea of PostModernism which, it can be seen, is all about what divides us.
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Here we come--Western Civilization--moving along to the beat of the Grand Narrative that comes out of the Middle East since the beginning of the Christian Era. Culture rides on the back of the ABSOLUTE TRUTH of Christianity. Governments have been formed and maintained based on power involved.
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Then, came the Enlightenment with its grandiose ideas of knowledge and science. Ideas that fly in the face of the ABSOLUTE TRUTH of the Grand Narrative by which men have lived since the beginning of history.
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Here--in this place where knowledge and Absolutism clash--is where we find a major aspect of Post Modernism. Whereas Modernism opens up culture to a pluralism, Post Modernism is seen as the power of knowledge coming into conflict with the Grand Narrative of Christianity.
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So, maybe we can say that it is Post Modernism that divides us?
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The current article in Protestantism attests to a main story of the Grand Narrative that claims Absolute Truth.
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http://protestantism.suite101.com/articl...
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-- posted by pink101

» pink101 - The Big Question

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I have been giving the ideas of belief a great deal of thought for several years.
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I come out of an Evangelical and Fundamentalist background. In fact, my family took a leadership role in bringing Fundamentalism to Michigan. I have listened to such men as the late Dr. Frank Norris in person. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J._Frank_No... ; http://www.jfranknorris.org/ and the late Harvey Springer http://www.carlmcintire.org/booklets-Yet... . Both of these men were stalwarts of Fundamentalism along with Dr. Carl McIntire who was notorious and the person who brought Fundamentalism to the place of such bad repute that its followers turned their backs on the use of the word, Fundamentalism, and put the word, Evangelicalism, in its place during the middle of the last century. I was there and I lived through those times.
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So, I was very deeply seated in the foundations of what passes for knowledge about reality in Christian Evangelicalism today.
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Grand Narrative, aka, MetaNarrative
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These are the stories upon which human society LEGITIMATED knowledge over the centuries up and until the Enlightenment.
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But, the stories that drove civilizations for so long are losing their credibility.
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Where shall we turn to find legitmation for knowledge today?
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That is the question we are forced to answer with the advent of postmodernism.
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Norris and Springer were both called to our fledgling Baptist church in Saginaw, Michigan, to build up its congregation. At the time, Norris was Pastor at the Temple Baptist church in Detroit. I remember riding in our church bus to visit Temple Baptist Church when I was six years old. My experience of how knowledge was made legitimate by Fundamentalism goes back to that time in my life which was 1937.
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-- posted by pink101

» Migisi - The Big Question

In response to The Big Question posted by pink101:
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So, if you can point to one time, idea, or situation which caused a transition or change in your thinking/beliefs, what and when would that be? Or was it so gradual that the changes went unnoticed?

-- posted by Migisi

» pink101 - Stories Just Don't Work Anymore

In response to The Big Question posted by Migisi:
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So, if you can point to one time, idea, or situation which caused a transition or change in your thinking/beliefs, what and when would that be?
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I has been the same for me as it has been for everyone else.
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In a single word?
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Postmodernism.
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In words from Jean-Francois Lyotard in his The Post-Modern Condition: A Report on Knowledge:
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"In contemporary society and culture--postindustrial society, postmodern culture--the question of the legitimation of knowledge is formulated in different terms. The grand narrative has lost its credibility, regardless of what mode of unification it uses, regardless of whether it is a speculative narrative or a narrative of emancipation." ***
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The stories just don't work anymore.
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What heroes do you consider?
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*** http://www.marxists.org/reference/subjec... (You can read the first five chapters here for free.)

-- posted by pink101

» Migisi - Stories Just Don't Work Anymore

In response to Stories Just Don't Work Anymore posted by pink101:
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The stories just don't work anymore.
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Nor for me either. When I see in them holes big enough to pilot the Queen Mary through, they lose all credibility and become entertaining myths/legends to me.
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What heroes do you consider?
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Rin Tin Tin and Lassie. No, Seriously. I can't think of anyone I'd consider a "hero". I must be a postmodernist, ay?
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Interesting link.

-- posted by Migisi

» pink101 - Stories Just Don't Work Anymore

In response to Stories Just Don't Work Anymore posted by Migisi:

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I must be a postmodernist, ay?
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We all are except those hermits, monks, and nuns you mentioned. And, they can't hold out for long.
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But, even so, the language games continue for a majority of the people here in the U.S.A.
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But, the games they play are losers.
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-- posted by pink101

» Brian Tubbs - Norris

In response to The Big Question posted by pink101:

My former pastor from Virginia - the guy who walked me through ordination - wrote an article on Frank Norris for the Baptist Bible Tribune. He re-posted much of the article on his blog. It is here...

http://www.fairoakschurch.org/tom/2005_0...

» pink101 - Norris

In response to Norris posted by BrianTubbs:

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My brother was baptized by Dr. Norris at Temple Baptist Church in Detroit along with others from our church in Saginaw, Michigan.
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Norris' wife was a big mannish woman and dominating as I recall.
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He was a contemporary of Carl McIntyre, the highly acclaimed fundamentalist who brought disrespect on Fundamentalism at a similar level as Father Coughlin from the Church of the Little Flower on the corner of Woodward and 12 Mile in Royal Oak, Michigan, did during the rise of fascism in Nazi Germany.
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There were many more in that whole bunch. They rode a wave of absolutism that signals to us today the danger of what can happen when religion gains an upper hand in society.
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-- posted by pink101