Protestantism

» redback - response for Jeff

In response to response for Jeff posted by _Boanerges_:

(boringness has prevailed yet again!)

It seems you wanted far more than I was able to give. But maybe my expectations of you were not set so high. May what bores you, leaves you.

-- posted by redback

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» pink101 - Appreciate it, Pink

In response to Appreciate it, Pink posted by BrianTubbs:

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Give me some examples as to how you see some of us failing in this.
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One of the main challenges I see is the question about the origins of the Bible. I do not see any others who profess to be Christians facing up to serious questions about the Bible as an authentic source of information.
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I'm out of town and using someone else's computer.
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later....

-- posted by pink101

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» _Boanerges_ - response for Jeff

In response to response for Jeff posted by redback:

It seems you wanted far more than I was able to give

I only asked a simple question.. in the hopes of engaging discussion.. but.. alas.. more of the same.. so.. never mind.. its not important at all....

hope all is well your way.. see you again.. the next time I might visit....

-- posted by _Boanerges_

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» redback - response for Jeff

In response to response for Jeff posted by _Boanerges_:

" in the hopes of engaging discussion..."

Sorry...I may have interpreted your question differently. Mine was a flippant reference to 'Tim' who you may not have seen. He's the one who adds a set of steak knives to every offer...and this has spilled over into folklore...many discussions here where we want election promises to include a set of steak knives as well.

I'm fine. Another 35 degree C day and the land gets drier. Take care.

-- posted by redback

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» EvilChihuahua - What do you want Christians to do?

In response to What do you want Christians to do? posted by BrianTubbs:

Well said, although most Atheists I know don't care what Christians do so long as they don't harm anyone (physically, mentally, etc.)

-- posted by EvilChihuahua

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» paper_turtle - What do you want Christians to do?

In response to What do you want Christians to do? posted by BrianTubbs:

What do you want Christians to do?
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Do you want us to abandon our beliefs? Do you want us to apologize for our beliefs?
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I expect from evangelical/conservative Christians what I expect from myself--respect and understanding. I expect to be treated after the model of Jesus, who did NOT lecture *lay* people about how wrong they were. Instead, he loved them into goodness. When people approached Jesus for healing, he did NOT place any conditions upon them, nor did he ask anything beyond "what do you want?" or "do you believe ...?" I expect not to be brow-beaten, or lectured, or insulted. I expect not to be told I am a miserable sinner simply because I don't believe what they believe.
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Do you want us to apologize for and/or explain all those who have professed to be or claimed to be Christian, but who have done offensive or objectionable things? Must I, as a Christian pastor, take responsibility for everyone in the world who claims to be a Christian - in that I must bear the guilt and/or shame of any wrong deed done by a self-professed Christian?
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What I would *like* to see is Christians of all denominations looking at the issues. That is, when a preson who professes himself a Christian does something "offensive or objectionable" I would like Christians to look at what it is about Christianity which might possibly have been a contributing factor. For example, just how could belief in a concrete devil lead some unbalanced person to kill another because he/she believed this other person was a personification of the devil?
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Do you believe Christians should keep all their views and opinions to themselves? That they should not have free access to the public square along with people of other faith and/or people of no faith? And if they do step into the public square, should Christians wear bold insignia that 'marks' them for suspicion and/or careful treatment? (I think Hitler did this with the Jews before he put them in concentration camps).
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Its not the statement of beliefs which offwnds me; its the way in which it is done--as if anyone who does not see things exactly as they do is not worthy of taking up space in the universe (or at least is to be regarded as a fool).
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I think an open, honest, and ***impartial*** consideration of faith/ethics/morals has an extremely important place in the public forum. What bothers me is when someone says he wants everyone to believe/speak/act as he does, or that his particular beliefs should be the law of the land.
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But you know, many Christians I know hardly ever feel the need to label their words or actions as Christian. They take seriously what Jesus said: "They will know us by our love." They make no secret of their beliefs. They openly attend church and talk about prayer, or reading their Bibles, or teaching Sunday School, but they don't shove their faith in anyone's faith.
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Now, YOU don't behave like that, but all too many Christians do, and it gives all of Christianity a bad name.
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peace and love,
Paper Turtle

-- posted by paper_turtle

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» pink101 - What do you want Christians to do?

In response to What do you want Christians to do? posted by paper_turtle:
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Thoughtful reply, PT.
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I think you have a good handle on much of what is wrong with so-called Evangelical/conservative Christianity.
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One thing I would add about Jesus is that he DID go after the Religionists--and hard--calling them like maggots eating the dead flesh in a sepulcher.
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-- posted by pink101

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» Brian Tubbs - Thanks, PT

In response to What do you want Christians to do? posted by paper_turtle:

I appreciated your thoughts, PT.

What I've preached to my congregation at Sligo is that we should "speak the truth in love." That is a recurring phrase in the NT.

Many fundamentalists speak the "truth" in anger or judgmentalism, and that's NOT what Jesus modeled or what Paul taught.

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» Brian Tubbs - Jesus

In response to What do you want Christians to do? posted by pink101:

True, Pink, but I do think there's a difference between exercising righteous indignation from time to time as opposed to continually berating others. Jesus didn't always treat the Pharisees and/or the Saduccees the way you indicate. He could be (and was) very kind and polite to them as well.

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» pink101 - Jesus

In response to Jesus posted by BrianTubbs:
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[Jesus] could be (and was) very kind and polite to [the Pharisees and/or the Saduccees] as well.
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Like I am to my Evangelical relatives, friends, and acquaintances?
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I don't mean to berate people; but, I do get after their ignorance and their wrong-headed ways when I think it is there. Even so, I don't do it continually.
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By the way, people of ALL stripes get after me and I don't complain about that--do I?
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-- posted by pink101

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