Protestantism

» pink101 - Maybe Bother Jones Will Say

In response to Lord, Liar, Lunatic, or.... posted by BrianTubbs:
.
It seems to me that Migisi and Pink hold to Category or Choice Number Four. Now, Pink, Migisi, if I'm incorrect, correct me. I'm not trying to think for you. I'm just stating my impression of where you're coming from.
.
I don't mind being included with others who hold similar views to mine--that's fine with me. It may even be a compliment for all I know.
.
I'm not so sure what I think of the biblical Jesus. At one time, I held the view that Jesus was a personal entity of great spiritual strength. But, the more I get tested by those who are given support as Christian spokespersons, the more my view is diminished.
.
I used to give certain comments precedence over all others. Revelatioins 3:20 is an example. Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me. I believed that and had a sense that it was an unfolding piece of reality in my life. But, I guess maybe I was wrong. It certainly is rejected by those here who give each other their support as being the true followers of Christ. What can I say? My personal experience doesn't seem to count with any Churchies. I have an idea of who or what it was that I thought was supping with me. Maybe Bother Jones will say as he has described my purpose in life quite often?
.

-- posted by pink101

Permalink Print Discussion Email Discussion How to subscribe to feeds

» Brother_Jones - Hubris

In response to Hubris posted by pink101:

Does what Jesus did forgive men like Richard Speck and that Gurney cannibal of their sins? Did Jesus die so that men like Joseph Stalin could be at one with God?

I guess you probably have been around some pretty bad guys given the fact that you are an older gentlemen. When I am in the jails, it does sometimes occur to me that I wouldn't have done what murderers have done. But who know what I might be capable of doing if I thought nobody held anyone accountable. Most of us would like to punish somebody somewhere for what they may have done to us. We all share in sin, hatred, and malice to some degree. Nobody is excluded. That is the first thing that Jesus preached when He came preaching 'repentance.'

I think one of the main reasons why Jesus forgave people their sins was that they really weren't sinners in the first place.

Then I think Jesus would have been laughed around the block and run off for being presumptious. Look, I know I am a difficult person to deal with sometimes. Most people who spend great amounts of time trying to do Apologetics tend to be rather mean and hostile. Would my life have turned out to be much better if I spent it trying to persuade people not to take Jesus seriously? I don't believe so. I would just be another person who feels my own opinions weigh as much as Jesus' and folks should not pay that much attention to a dead guy from the past.

the oldtimer.

-- posted by Brother_Jones

Permalink Print Discussion Email Discussion How to subscribe to feeds

» Brother_Jones - Lord, Liar, Lunatic, or....

In response to Lord, Liar, Lunatic, or.... posted by BrianTubbs:

4. Jesus was a powerful teacher, whose life and teachings were hijacked and embellished by his followers (including and perhaps especially Paul - and then the early church leaders of the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th centuries)

I know this choice seems to have some followers but it presents two very difficult problems for me. His followers couldn't have known at the time of the writing of the New Testament how these testimonies would be received by anyone. And the other big problem is Paul. He seemed to have given up his status as a great religious person to be a person who is beaten, jailed, and persecuted for his beliefs. Why would he be motivated to spend his life in deception? He wrote the great love chapter in 1 Cor 13 and he has always seemed like a person who is telling the truth in a very calm, exact way. It just doesn't work for me to see a big conspiracy concerning a few guys or a bunch of guys who wish to control history by inventing a person like Jesus.

the oldtimer.

-- posted by Brother_Jones

Permalink Print Discussion Email Discussion How to subscribe to feeds

» pink101 - Bother Jones--Sir Hudibras

In response to Hubris posted by Brother_Jones:
.
"...I think Jesus would have been laughed around the block and run off for being presumptious."
.
I think I know YOUR type only TOO WELL.
.
I expect YOU have NEVER been accused of anything of which YOU were not guilty. It's almost too easy for you to say something about how you are a "Sinner Saved by Grace". I can see you talking to some poor inmut telling him how your sins are just as dark to God as are his murder, rape, etc. YOUR sins! Hah! I can imagine.
.
But, I seriously doubt that YOU can identify with the person who is accused of something for which they bear no guilt whatsoever, other than the fact that people like you say they were born in sin. What a farce!
.
It makes sense to me that people exactly like you would have laughed Jesus around the block, as you say, for opening the door to the possibility that they could just reach out and have the Kingdom of God within their being and that they didn't need to kau-tau to the Religious Right of the day. Worse than that, they would have given all their support to the Church Rulers to get him lynched for teaching such a blasphemous thing.
.
Bother Jones--Sir Hudibras~
.

-- posted by pink101

Permalink Print Discussion Email Discussion How to subscribe to feeds

» Brother_Jones - Bother Jones--Sir Hudibras

In response to Bother Jones--Sir Hudibras posted by pink101:

Well, there is no point in beating up on each other. You can make some very good points about how preachers sometimes do that to folks. No argument from me. I've seen it too. I'm sorry if I get a little animated concerning the nature and character of Jesus. It pushes hot buttons at every angle. I am a sinner saved by grace. Maybe sometimes I don't act like it or represent Christ very well. But, I guess you are willing to admit the same bad attitude from time to time. Whatever Jesus said to anybody will be remembered and recounted long after you and I are gone because something quite amazing happened at that point in history. I believe it happened as the story is given to us. And you don't.

the oldtimer.

-- posted by Brother_Jones

Permalink Print Discussion Email Discussion How to subscribe to feeds

» pink101 - Bother Jones--Sir Hudibras

In response to Bother Jones--Sir Hudibras posted by Brother_Jones:
.
I bloom where I was planted.
.
I didn't make a choice to be born into the situation of my birth any more than you.
.
My bringing up was nothing I chose nor were the conditions of the society in which I grew to manhood.
.
But, I turned out to be a deviant--I went off away from what authority demanded of me. It appears that you didn't and that you stayed on the course to which you were launched.
.
My deviance brought me to where I have come to be. How was I able to be a deviant in a situation where others had control of my destiny?
.
Those are the kinds of questions over which people who think like you have their most serious problems.
.
It is all relative to your view of society which you have posted is just a bunch of people each capable of making their own autonomous choice about what to do next. We HAVE to forgive the little ones of their sins. And, we have a responsibility to help them to grow beyond where they have been planted. But, that's liberalism, isn't it? And that cannot be tolerated.
.
.

-- posted by pink101

Permalink Print Discussion Email Discussion How to subscribe to feeds

» Brother_Jones - Bother Jones--Sir Hudibras

In response to Bother Jones--Sir Hudibras posted by pink101:

It is all relative to your view of society which you have posted is just a bunch of people each capable of making their own autonomous choice about what to do next. We HAVE to forgive the little ones of their sins. And, we have a responsibility to help them to grow beyond where they have been planted. But, that's liberalism, isn't it? And that cannot be tolerated.

Just disagreeing with you is all that I can do. You say we have to forgive the little ones of their sins. I never had to that. I never felt that I could forgive anyone unless they harmed me personally. And then I never thought of them as a little one if they damaged me personally. I think you are advocating humanism more than liberalism. And humanism doesn't really define sin. I don't especially have any kind of hard feelings about humanism or humanists. They reject Christ as Savior and there really isn't anything anyone can say to such a person to cause the spirit of God to fill them if they decide Jesus was some kind of a hoax. Usually a fit moment or an unusual crisis in life reminds most folks that life is all about forgiveness and redemption. It's not like there are hundreds of gods out there to choose from. God has come to us in the form of a man, Jesus Christ.

Humanism certainly has a right to preach that society and culture is the basic building block of life, not God.

the oldtimer

-- posted by Brother_Jones

Permalink Print Discussion Email Discussion How to subscribe to feeds

» pink101 - Bother Jones--Sir Hudibras

In response to Bother Jones--Sir Hudibras posted by Brother_Jones:

.
Preaching to the choir again.
.
Or should I say, still?
.
heh heh heh
.

.
Your kids in G.R. are being treated to the color show with the change of seasons here in Michigan. Soon to hit Illinois.
.
.

-- posted by pink101

Permalink Print Discussion Email Discussion How to subscribe to feeds

» Migisi - Lord, Liar, Lunatic, or....

In response to Lord, Liar, Lunatic, or.... posted by BrianTubbs:

.
Yes, of the four you offered, I'd lean towards #4.

-- posted by Migisi

Permalink Print Discussion Email Discussion How to subscribe to feeds

» Migisi - A Good Case.

In response to A Good Case. posted by Brother_Jones:
.
I feel like I'm whippin a dead horse here... But you have read what Lewis wrote. Right?
.
Neigh, neigh. I've read what YOU wrote.
.
Of course you do know that in Mark 3:21, even Jesus' family (or friends) said "He is out of his mind" (or "beside himself", "lost his senses", depending on the Bible version). And in John 7:5, it's written "For even his own brothers [or "brethren"] did not believe in him." In Mark 6, his own townspeople in Nazareth rejected him. His family, brothers, and townspeople were all folks who knew him well, even intimately. That says a lot to me.

-- posted by Migisi

Permalink Print Discussion Email Discussion How to subscribe to feeds