Protestantism

» redback - Pink's progress

In response to flip posted by Brother_Jones:

Thanks, BJ. I understand macro economics to some point and about markets correcting themselves. These same markets...at least here...aggressively offer and approve loans to people with no real objective capacity to service their loans. Maybe 5 years or so before the 'flip' so the connection is not seen.

Hence, even a 0.25% increase in the interest rate by our own Greenspan mandarins or their careless purchase of a plasma TV etc, sends them to the wall for their own personal 'corrections'. An increase in the unemployment rate is also 'corrective' too but tis hard to bring it all back to context and the real points you make.

Tis an election argument here. Both parties claim to be economic experts with one claiming it cares for the real people, better. The writing is on the wall there too.

"Pinky's idea that we have a legend..."

I'm not excited about your summary of what may be called 'Pink's Progress' re any rainbow in the sky. Actually, these things DO exist but Pink's not the one claiming the pot of gold at its end, is he? (Is there a thing called Fool's gold over there?)

This ancient story does impact me, BJ. I provided a link earlier that seemed to mesh the 2 versions...without rebuttal. As far as my own shirt is concerned, I'd be happy to discuss what the higher message is intended to be...but I do on occasions pee in the wind with my requests.

-- posted by redback

» Brother_Jones - Pink's progress

In response to Pink's progress posted by redback:

I'm not excited about your summary of what may be called 'Pink's Progress'

I'm all thumbs when it comes to the rehab of the Pink. lol. Our society has enough philosophers in my view. And I appear too often to be another one. I'm anxious to get to this Christmas so that I can muddle over giving my grandson a little cap gun. But we tend to exaggerate every position and listen alot to anyone who has a title of Bishop in front of their name. I am trying to teach fishing skills to my son-in-laws this next holiday but there is a common ingredient alive and well in generation x. And that ingredient is that Jesus must have found those poor little Galilean fish that he cooked lying up on the bank dead and already in heaven. So Guns, knives, and arrows for little boys have sorta taken a back spot at the Walmart where I live. Happy Turkey day!

Give thanks with a grateful heart to the almighty God who lives!

the oldtimer

-- posted by Brother_Jones

» Migisi - Sad story

In response to Pink's progress posted by redback:
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The problem is SO far-reaching.
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True story:
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Jack and Jane Doe are newlyweds looking to experience the American Dream -- owning their own home, starting a family, etc. They're in their mid 20s, have attended college for a couple of years, and both work earning a combined annual income of about $70 thousand. They want to live close to work because of soaring gas prices. They drive around, see a house, and call the number listed on the real estate sign. The realtor recommends they get 'qualified' by a lending institution.
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The market is flooded with lender ads offering them dream deals. They call one. The lender qualifies them for a $250,000 loan at an adjustable interest rate, doesn't require a cash downpayment, and overlooks their other outstanding debt. What a deal!! The lender says they can afford it. Jack and Jane sign all the papers, and they become happy homeowners.
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Six month's later, Jack's employer announces that he's down-sizing, laying off workers, and moving operations to Mexico (NAFTA has made this move very attractive). Jane becomes pregnant. Jack gets laid off. They decide they must sell their dream home to get out from under their enormous debt. They plan to rent an apartment and save for the medical expenses that come with a baby. Jane's employer never provided medical insurance, and Jack lost his when he was laid off.
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During the fast paper shuffle and signing at their house closing, they had failed to read everything. Like the 'prepayment penalty' their lender had attached to the loan. They didn't know that if they sold or refinanced before a specific date (usually within the first year or two), they'd be penalized -- required to pay a percentage of their loan back to the lender, in ~addition~ to the original loan. So, if they sold their home for only what was due on their loan, they'd ~still~ owe the lender thousands of dollars in penalty fees. (IMO, that's loan sharking.) So, they add the penalty to their selling price. Problem is, the market has crashed and there are no buyers. Nobody's even looking anymore. They'll try to refinance, despite the penalty. Given their current debt troubles, no new lender will even talk to them about it.
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Jack and Jane are in serious financial trouble. They can't sell, can't refinance, and can't pay their mortgage. They default, the house is repossessed, and they have to pack up and move in a month.
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Jack and Jane look for an apartment, but discover that they can't even rent three rooms because their credit rating has been destroyed. Because their credit is so bad, their auto insurance premiums go through the roof at renewal time. They're put in the insurance pool paying the highest rate - even though their driving record is clean and they've never had a claim. The increase in premiums takes money away from their car payments. Their cars are repossessed. They buy old used cars - but still pay outrageous insurance premiums because of low credit score.
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The financial stress overwhelms them, and creates problems in their marriage. They can't get divorced because no lawyer will represent them without money up front. They separate. Being pregnant and now jobless, Jane moves in with her parents. Jack moves in with his brother. The baby is born, hospital bills mount, and creditors keep calling. Daycare costs are outrageous. Jane can't go to work. Jane tries to file bankruptcy to stop creditors from harrassing her, but the bankruptcy laws were changed making relief almost impossible. Jane applies for government assistance. Jack's been looking for work, but even menial jobs are going to illegal aliens. Jack's unemployment runs out. He can't support his baby. He starts drinking.
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Jane and Jack's parents have tried to rescue them - and have exhausted what little life savings they had. Gramma cries as she cradles the baby - and wonders how she's going to support two generations and herself when social security is reduced after Grampa dies.
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The American Dream? More of a nightmare for SO many Americans.
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-- posted by Migisi

» pink101 - Pink's progress

In response to Pink's progress posted by Brother_Jones:

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Foul ball, B.J.
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Jeff! I'd be happy to read your take on the higher message here.
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Art, it is said, is in the eyes of the beholder.
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Wind that baby up and give us a fast one.
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Thankee Kindlee.
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-- posted by pink101

» pink101 - Sad story

In response to Sad story posted by Migisi:

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Nice hit, Migisi.
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So, who benefits in that scenario?
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Looks like something to do with class warfare.
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-- posted by pink101

» _Boanerges_ - Sad story

In response to Sad story posted by Migisi:

sad? naa.. its the world of men, without hope..

welcome to the world of men.....

no wonder the ancient Greeks employed Nihilism...

whats so sad about life? some win and some lose.. who really cares.. I mean, if life is just this, then its survival of the fittest, ey..

but then.. maybe someones god can come through and put them on their feet?.. if not.. whats the point in all of this nonsense about some poor couple who rested their hopes on mere mortals...

sad indeed....

-- posted by _Boanerges_

» Migisi - Sad story

In response to Sad story posted by _Boanerges_:
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maybe someones god can come through and put them on their feet?..
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They were good Christian kids who prayed to YOUR god for guidance and help. They got a stone instead of bread.
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Indeed... whats the point in all of this nonsense about some poor couple who rested their hopes on mere... God.
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Give thanks today - that it didn't happen to you.

-- posted by Migisi

» _Boanerges_ - Sad story

In response to Sad story posted by Migisi:

but Mig.. all of the Biblical men and women were destroyed... utterly...

so.. why should this couple have an "abundant" life as preached by the prosperity preachers of the 21st century?...

now then.. why blame a god? if god is not.. then, welcome to the world of mankind... if that is true, then, thats all there is...

so.. see how much better life is for you and me than - them!...

some win.. some lose..

if all we have is this.. then.. who cares about some poor souls who are miserable and destitute..

-- posted by _Boanerges_

» _Boanerges_ - didn't happen to you (me)

In response to Sad story posted by Migisi:

no thanks needed for that, Mig... I did not follow their path of the "american dream".....

I did it much different than chasing "dreams"...

-- posted by _Boanerges_

» pink101 - A Dodge

In response to Sad story posted by _Boanerges_:
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"but then.. maybe someones god can come through and put them on their feet?.. if not.. whats the point in all of this nonsense about some poor couple who rested their hopes on mere mortals..."
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Nothing against you, Wendell, but that story is a dodge and it's been played for longer than history recalls.
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It takes the focus away from the real problem and puts it on something to do with the supernatural. So, the economic technique being discussed--here that includes the flip--is seen as something unexpected and having to do with bad luck or worse--god's plan for the ages.
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When capitalism is allowed to run rampant and unbridled, there gets to be a time when there is a major sweep-up of property.
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What Brother Jones is doing is small time. Anyone with good credit and a decent job can get in on it; but, like he states, there is a risk involved. Proceed with caution. Hopefully, you are buffered.
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But, it has nothing to do with any god that will watch out for you. Unless that god is Manon, the God of Money. That's the one all capitalists rely on.
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-- posted by pink101