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ProtestantismVenezuela
« Previous 1 2 3 4 5 Next » » Migisi - Now, wait a minute In response to Now, wait a minute posted by BrianTubbs:
-- posted by Migisi » Migisi - First American interview . Barbara Walters interviews Chavez: ABC television interview with Hugo Chavez http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kDaSJ23DR... -- posted by Migisi » pink101 - First American interview In response to First American interview posted by Migisi:
-- posted by pink101
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They have legal status in the United States. They still love Venezuela, though, and would like to return some day. I really wish I could say more, because it would just about prove to you and Pink and other Chavez defenders here how ruthless and evil a man he is. But I can't. I don't have their permission to do so. » pink101 - Answering Migisi In response to Answering Migisi posted by BrianTubbs:
-- posted by pink101 » Brother_Jones - Answering Migisi In response to Answering Migisi posted by BrianTubbs:They still love Venezuela Americans really don't understand what is happening in Venezuela it seems. Barbara Walters in the interview did not ask a single question about how Venezuelans feel about the dictator. My relatives who are there now in the country fear for their lives, their business, and their future ability to leave the country. He has destroyed the middle class culture along with the rich Venezuelans who oppose him. The average citizen, if there is such, is caught in the same maelstrom that exists today in Cuba, just desperately poor people who can stand in a bread line daily and a hospital line if they need some help up the economic ladder. But he hates Bush, so all is forgiven. i am just an oldtimer for the Lord. -- posted by Brother_Jones » pink101 - Answering Brian & Brother Jones In response to Answering Migisi posted by Brother_Jones:. My sister and her family lived in South America as missionaries for most of their life since the early 1940s. One of my family with his wife and four children is returning in four weeks for another four years after a one year furlough. We will be having a going away party soon. I cannot be bamboozled with any jazzed up rhetoric. . I am very well acquainted with how things are in those countries and have been made aware of it since I was a young child. I personally knew people who were killed and eaten by head hunters in the jungles of South America. . I have long heard stories like those pointed at by Brian and Brother Jones almost from the beginning. . I also have heard other stories about how life is for the Americans and the Brits--not just the missionaries. . Anyone who is interested in what stories come from people who claim the S.A. governments are so bad needs to gain some basic understandings. It helps to ask some serious questions. . What's involved? The Catholic Church is very strong in most of South America. The United States is, generally, different than the rest of the societies on this hemisphere in that we are NOT a sectarian state. Almost all the others are and they are heavily Roman Catholic. . So, what's wrong with that? . One of the things has to do with the hierarchical way authority is arranged as a metaphor for thinking about power. . Leaders MUST act against the power of the church while at the same time they must pay due respect for the ideologies that control the thinking of the people. . It is a very complicated situation. I think it could easily constitute a doctoral program through some very prestigious university. . Not an easy subject to understand, right? . -- posted by pink101
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AND...when you transform a society from one economic system to another (in this case...capitalism to socialism), it necessitates the taking of some drastic measures. This is why every nation that has done so has been accused (rightly so) of authoritarianism (i.e., dictatorship), human rights abuses, property confiscations, stifling of free speech, etc. Folks like you are not super-comfortable with these drastic measures, but you understand that they are the inevitable result of such a societal transformation - which you see as a good thing. Thus, you use lines like "it's a complicated situation." If I'm being too presumptuous about your feelings on this matter, I apologize. But it SEEMS like I'm not far off - if I'm off at all. I think you generally support the direction Chavez is taking Venezuela, and thus you're willing to cut him a LOT of slack when it comes to how he's affecting those who disagree with him or don't support him. I find it interesting, though, that you cut NO SUCH SLACK to George W. Bush. And I think the reason is that you do NOT support the direction Bush is taking America. What this all boils down to is... Do the ends justify the means? You oppose Bush's "ends" and you support Chavez's "ends." Right? So, for you, what's complicated is sorting through all the "means" that Chavez is utilizing to achieve his ends. There's no need for you to explore that with Bush, because you don't support his "ends" at all. I'm not writing this to offend you. But I really think I'm on to something here. » pink101 - Answering Brian & Brother Jones In response to Answering Brian & Brother Jones posted by BrianTubbs:
-- posted by pink101 » Migisi - Answering Brian & Brother Jones In response to Answering Brian & Brother Jones posted by BrianTubbs:. He's moving Venezuela away from capitalism and toward socialism - which you see as a good thing. . There are several socialist-governed countries which are our allies - like Sweden, Norway, and Denmark. And there are countries which maintain constitutional references to socialism - like Egypt, India, and Portugal. So, it's not like the US flatly refuses to deal with socialist countries. Nor is it obvious to me that a socialistic government is always oppressive. The Swiss and Dutch don't appear to be suffering. . It's clear that decades of foreign capitalism haven't done anything to improve economic conditions for most Venezuelans - or there'd be no need for a move away from it. From what I've read, the objection Chavez has is the exploitation of Venezuela's natural resources and laborers by foreigners. Frankly, I don't blame him or his people for wanting to prosper, and keep their country's wealth within their own borders. . The Venezuelans elected Chavez (more than once) by popular vote knowing full well what direction he was moving in. No secrets. No surprises. (I can't say the same for Bush and his pals.) It's what the ~Venezuelans~ want that matters - not what you or I want, or what Bush or the US and international corporate vultures want. The Venezuelans have the right to self-determination. . Now, I'm not saying Chavez is a superhero or an angel. Not even close. But neither is Bush, and you voted for and support him, no? Imagine then - an uprising orchestrated by foreign covert operatives to overthrow (and assassinate) ~your~ President. I think you'd be angry enough to call the one who approved the operation a 'donkey' - and likely far worse. Sometimes we need to step into Chavez's shoes for a day to understand. -- posted by Migisi « Previous 1 2 3 4 5 Next » Please follow the guidelines set forth in the Suite101 Posting Etiquette when adding to the discussion. |
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Brian Tubbs
