Protestantism

» Migisi - Jones doesn't know

In response to Bo Knows posted by Brother_Jones:
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Me: "But I'm still confused why a Protestant would convert to Catholicism?"
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You: I don't know.
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Me neither. I wonder... if someone is dissatisfied with their own personal spiritual growth (or lack of), who's fault is that - their church's? I get a kick out of believer's blaming their church for their own weakness and laziness in faith. What's stopping them from seeking spiritual satisfaction and growth on their own? Instead, they go shopping and church-hopping to find the best deal. Laughable.

-- posted by Migisi

» Brother_Jones - Jones doesn't know

In response to Jones doesn't know posted by Migisi:

Instead, they go shopping and church-hopping to find the best deal. Laughable.

Your irreverence is predictable. I was talking about someone who was really hurting, not someone who is looking for another philosophy.

i am just an oldtimer for the Lord.

-- posted by Brother_Jones

» pink101 - Maybe BJ Does Know

In response to Jones doesn't know posted by Brother_Jones:
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The thing the people like about Catholicism is that the church takes care of the details.
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The problem with Protestantism is that the church makes it the responsibility of the people to take care of the details.
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In other words, if you attend the Catholic Church you experience very little restrictions on your life style and the priest himself can attend the wedding receptions and drink right along with the worst of them and enjoy every minute of it. In Protestant churches, the spies are watching your every move to make sure you don't stray from the straight and narrow. If you do, two members are assigned to approach you with corrective measures to help you understand your responsibilities now that you are a believer. If you fail to get in line, there is something called disfellowship that means you are assigned persona non gratia status at all official meetings of the church body. Group parameters are tightly drawn.
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Why wouldn't anyone rather be a Catholic--other than the catechism?
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One of the fastest growing churches here in Kalamazoo Country is a "Community Christian Church" in which every life style except homosexuality is welcomed. It's Protestant.
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-- posted by pink101

» pink101 - Being Slippery

In response to Being Slippery posted by Brother_Jones:
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Probably enough said on that subject. You explain it pretty well. I'm trying to get some focus today. People grow up in highly authoritarian churches like mine, and they generally leave because they get mad at the 'management.' It rarely has anything to do with Jesus.
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Been there and done that.
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But, do you see the paradox in the works vs faith idea as it is held out in most Evangelical churches?
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That paradox leans on a person's mind and annoys them to no end underneath it all. Even though, on the surface, everything appears to be all right. It isn't. The human mind is trained from infancy to recognize the differences between logical and illogical.
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The older you get, Brother Jones, the more you're going to have to swallow reason and accept the illogical. Otherwise, you--too--will leave the fold. You'll get tired of the hammering either in giving it or in taking it.
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I watched Hagee this morning for about five minutes before I almost blew my safety valve. The man is a raving maniac who is teaching some of the worst racial hatred I have ever heard. His diatribe on Iran is inciteful to all out war in the Middle East. He wants Bush to attack Iran today or tomorrow at the latest. He presents, in my view of reality, a clear and present danger. During the short time I watched, he defintely predicted nuclear weapons would be set off soon in New York, Houston, LosAngeles, Chicago, Miami, Atlanta, and I can't recall the other; but, I think it was in Arizona. And, he advocated going after Iran without further delay. The people of his church are fools to follow his hate mongering sermons. He epitomizes what is wrong with the world.
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-- posted by pink101

» HeadZenCards - Bo Knows

In response to Bo Knows posted by Brother_Jones:

Why doesn't the Word of God clear up these disputes, instead of giving justification for just about any position?

-- posted by HeadZenCards

» Brother_Jones - Bo Knows

In response to Bo Knows posted by HeadZenCards:

Why doesn't the Word of God clear up these disputes, instead of giving justification for just about any position?

I have rarely seen Christians on this site in disagreement on any major issue concerning Jesus Christ.

i am just an oldtimer for the Lord.

-- posted by Brother_Jones

» redback - Brother Jones

In response to Bo Knows posted by Brother_Jones:

An aside.

I am aware of the dispropionate make-up of the prison populations here, partic those with mental illness.

I was wondering given your visitations (still continuing???) if you could start up a topic, like a diary, of your experiences?

-- posted by redback

» Brother_Jones - Brother Jones

In response to Brother Jones posted by redback:

if you could start up a topic

The Texas Prisons changed to a new policy about a year back which forced drug related programs to eliminate any religious references, which ended our long standing relationship with the women's prison system with weekly classes. I will keep you posted if we are able to return. We still are able to have monthly rallies.

i am just an oldtimer for the Lord.

-- posted by Brother_Jones

» paper_turtle - Church hopping

In response to Jones doesn't know posted by Migisi:

Migisi wrote:
if someone is dissatisfied with their own personal spiritual growth (or lack of), who's fault is that - their church's? I get a kick out of believer's blaming their church for their own weakness and laziness in faith. What's stopping them from seeking spiritual satisfaction and growth on their own? Instead, they go shopping and church-hopping to find the best deal. Laughable.
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I think you're discounting the importance of group dynamics. If your place of work was full of people who constantly found fault with everything you did, and/or in your boss was a total jerk, you would do your best to either change the situation or find a new job. Its extremely difficult to remain healthy in a sick environment.
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Church, at its best, is a group expression of private faith. People go to church for the experience of community--fellowship, encouragement, support, understanding. If the church as a whole is not providing authentic community it affects the spiritual health of the individuals, no matter how strong and wise they might be.
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Its not just about finding the "best deal" doctrinally.
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In any situation, we seek out the companionship of like-minded individuals who will treat us with love and respect and affirm our worth. We want to be with people who "speak our language." This is true of *any* group we might join.
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peace and love,
Paper Turtle

-- posted by paper_turtle

» paper_turtle - TCOB

In response to Maybe BJ Does Know posted by pink101:

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Phil wrote:
The thing the people like about Catholicism is that the church takes care of the details.
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The problem with Protestantism is that the church makes it the responsibility of the people to take care of the details.
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In other words, if you attend the Catholic Church you experience very little restrictions on your life style and the priest himself can attend the wedding receptions and drink right along with the worst of them and enjoy every minute of it. In Protestant churches, the spies are watching your every move to make sure you don't stray from the straight and narrow. If you do, two members are assigned to approach you with corrective measures to help you understand your responsibilities now that you are a believer. If you fail to get in line, there is something called disfellowship that means you are assigned persona non gratia status at all official meetings of the church body. Group parameters are tightly drawn.
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Mainline Protestant churches (e.g., Methodist, Congregationalist, Episcopalian) do not have "spies" (at least not officially designated ones), nor do they practice disfellowship. This does not mean that in *any* Christian community, Protestant of Catholic, some individual (or group of individuals) will not take it upon himself/themselves to give you his/their version of what you "ought" to be doing. But whatever this person/group says carries no weight regarding who may or may not enjoy fellowship with the congregation.
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As far as the "details" go, it seems to me that both Protestants and Catholics share the same tendency as the general public in *secular* pursuits: the avoidance of freedom and personal responsibility.
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peace and love,
Paper Turtle

-- posted by paper_turtle