Protestantism

» pink101 - On Your Dead Mother's Grave

In response to Back to your original question posted by Migisi:
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"We can change our minds..."
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Maybe YOU can change your mind; but, put your self in the shoes of a person who has made repeated public announcements of their beliefs in some absolute truth about which they claim to have absolutely no doubts whatsoever. It's like swearing on your dead mother's grave.
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Have you ever noticed such a person hereabouts?
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Generally, they are unable to give voice to any ideas that do not fit in very neatly and tightly with their avowed beliefs.
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Could this be a place where the boys are separated from the men and the girls from the women?
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-- posted by pink101

» HeadZenCards - Jews to sue Vet Administration over proselytizing

In response to Jews to sue Vet Administration over proselytizing posted by Migisi:

Thanks for the article.

More power to them. This is some of what he suffered by being told:

"You mean you don't believe that Jesus is the Messiah?" and "Is it just Orthodox Jews who deny Jesus?" He said one staffer told him, "I don't understand; how can you not believe in Jesus; he's the Messiah of the Jews, too, you know."

Why do Jews not believe in Jesus? Wouldn't the Jews know their "savior" if He really showed up?

I still like pie.

-- posted by HeadZenCards

» Migisi - On Your Dead Mother's Grave

In response to On Your Dead Mother's Grave posted by pink101:
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of a person who has made repeated public announcements of their beliefs in some absolute truth about which they claim to have absolutely no doubts whatsoever. It's like swearing on your dead mother's grave.
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More like my mother would roll over in her grave? Eh, she never liked sleeping on her back anyway. (wink)
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I made repeated proclamations of faith here back then. So what. It's just as easy as changing one's mind about a political candidate. The more you learned about him, the less (or more) you liked him. Like hating coffee as a child, and loving it as an adult. We change. Nothing's chipped in marble. "Free will" means having the ability to change our minds about anything. Too few people exercise their free will - or their minds.

-- posted by Migisi

» pink101 - In Brother Jones' Shoes?

In response to On Your Dead Mother's Grave posted by Migisi:
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Can you put yourself in Brother Jones' shoes regarding his beliefs about God?
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If you can, how would you go about having a change of mind?
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-- posted by pink101

» Migisi - In Brother Jones' Shoes?

In response to In Brother Jones' Shoes? posted by pink101:

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Can you put yourself in Brother Jones' shoes regarding his beliefs about God?
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Thinking about it... not really. His upbringing and life (from what I've gleened) are very different than mine. And it seems far more difficult for a man to change his mind...as if change is an admission of a past error or a indication of imperfection in them. I have a hard time relating to that.
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As for me, when the subject of belief came up with my family, I simply announced that I'd changed my mind, and explained why. This led to a long discussion, and ended with everyone agreeing 'to each his own'. It's not the first time I've changed my mind about things, so it didn't come as a big shock to them. My college-age nephew, however, expressed worry that I was going to Hell. Wonder where he got ~that~ idea from. I've never surrounded myself with Christians exclusively, and didn't belong to a church. So changing my mind had no impact on my circle of friends and/or business associates.

-- posted by Migisi

» _Boanerges_ - as Gandol tells the Borimeir of Gandor.....

In response to Back to your original question posted by Migisi:

If you review my posts in the archived threads when I first arrived at Suite, and compare my posts today, you will see an about-face in my beliefs. Migisi is a different person than Fundy Hawknut.

Gandolf told Borimeir, as he was heading to death (Return of the King).. your father loves you, Borimeir.. In time, he will remember...

I believe, that in time, you will return Hawknut..

-- posted by _Boanerges_

» pink101 - In Brother Jones' Shoes?

In response to In Brother Jones' Shoes? posted by Migisi:
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So, you are unable to understand what it would take for Brother Jones to change his mind?
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-- posted by pink101

» Migisi - In Brother Jones' Shoes?

In response to In Brother Jones' Shoes? posted by pink101:

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Desire.

-- posted by Migisi

» paper_turtle - Change

In response to In Brother Jones' Shoes? posted by pink101:

Can you put yourself in Brother Jones' shoes regarding his beliefs about God?
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How does one understand the viewpoint of another regarding anything?

I believe we start by listening (or give attention to the written word)--without formulating responses in our mind as we listen.

I think we listen for what is beneath the surface--what would cause a person to find a particular view point attractive? What motivates this person? What life experiences might predispose him or her to think/feel a certain way?

But the thing is, another person is not going to reveal much if he/she feels every word is going to be questioned, disputed, or in some other way implicitly rejected.

If you can, how would you go about having a change of mind?
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Yes, as Migisi said, desire is part of it. But I think first comes the uncomfortable sensation that something is wrong, something isn't working or doesn't fit right (cognitive dissonance).

Because of other influences in one's life this dissonance may be denied (or at least shoved to the back of one's mind). The person may be in a group which would reject him/her if he/she were to change. The person might find he feels uncomfortable in situations where he used to feel right at home.

Certain habits or beliefs are strongly tied to one's sense of identity. To relinquish the belief/habit can be very intimidating.

The person has to see, for herself, that the change is *better* than maintaining the status quo. The person also has to believe that he/she is capable of making the change, and staying changed. He will have a better chance of successfully changing if he has a support group of some sort to recognize his successes in affecting positive change.

The thing is, we all have something in our life which could do with a change. Its not just BroJo.

peace and love,
Paper Turtle

-- posted by paper_turtle

» HeadZenCards - Change

In response to Change posted by paper_turtle:

The Scientologists, thirty-five years ago anyway, had a way that seemed to work on the surface: they listened (as PT advises) then they matched tones with people they wanted to change to their way of thinking.

My experience is that when they really want to change people, they become a mirror to them first.

Usually, that is a horrible experience. Unless they've been totally destroyed, which happens more times than you would think, they have to want to deal with what's left and see value in continuing, which happens a lot less than you think it would, in order to effect a change up the tone scale, from despair to sarcasm to confrontation to boredom to interest to enthusiasm.

With Brother Jones, I would talk baseball, discuss players and teams that he is attracted to, now that we've got the religion thing out of the way.

But I kind of like him the way he is and hope his kind never changes. Or am I being sarcastic? Oh, yeah, well stuff it! I couldn't be bothered, really. But once in a while I get a kick when I see a tiny change in someone. Then my whole day turns into one great big party!

-- posted by HeadZenCards